T. Gorton

Mr. GORTON

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I believe we now have a full list of amendments to be proposed by Members on this side of the aisle, and I believe the other side of the aisle is very close to that point. I urge anyone who wishes to add his or her name to do so. I hope that soon we can at least get the unanimous consent agreement on what amendments remain to be discussed. Amendment No. 2305 (Purpose: To permit the use of funds for the award of grants to individuals for National Heritage Fellowships and American Jazz Masters Fellowships)

Mr. GORTON. I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. GORTON. It is the committee's intent to provide sufficient funds for research so that research units such as the Great Lakes Science Center and other aquatic fishery research centers can continue to operate in fiscal year 1996 to the extent possible.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, what amendment do we return now to?

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I want to compliment the Senators from Idaho, who have spoken, and the Senator from Texas, both Senators from Vermont, and the Senator from Arkansas, and the Senator from Massachusetts, for the way in which we have been able to accommodate what I think is the justified expectations of people who sometimes rather strongly disagree. In any event, they formed a powerful combine, and together, with the cooperation from the Senator from North Carolina, who is deeply concerned about matters relating to obscenity and disrespect for religion, we have come upon and agreed upon an amendment in this field. I wish to make public the private assurances that I gave to the Senator from Vermont, Mr. Jeffords, that this is not a pro forma amendment that I have agreed to, and I will defend the position of the Senate in any conference vigorously. With that, I hope and trust that we are ready to accept the amendment by a voice vote.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that Senator Burns be added as a cosponsor to the amendment of Senator Craig.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, having spoken earlier to determine whether or not there were any objections or anyone else to speak, we have no speakers, and I believe we are ready to put the question. Natural Resources Science Agency's [NRSA] Great Lakes Science Center in Ann Arbor, MI

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, a technical point. I ask unanimous consent the last committee amendment adopted on the National Endowment for the Arts be considered as original text for the purpose of amendment.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I yield the floor. Mr. JEFFORDS addressed the Chair.

Mr. GORTON. I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, this is the committee amendment dealing with the endowment. The Senator from Arizona [Mr. McCain], had objected to our taking that up last night. He has now withdrawn that objection if we adopt it under the same circumstances that we have adopted the other committee amendments. As a part of the overall text, it will be open to amendment. So I do not believe there is any debate on it. I urge the adoption of the amendment. The committee amendment on page 95, lines 19-21, was agreed to.

Mr. GORTON. I ask unanimous consent that further reading of the amendment be dispensed with.

Mr. GORTON. Second, Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that we lay aside the pending amendment and take up the committee amendment found on page 95, lines 19-21.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, the remarks of the Senator from Vermont are totally appropriate. We are in the process of what I hope will be a successful attempt to work out changes in the appropriations bill to be adopted. I greatly appreciate the remarks that we have just heard. I must say, Mr. President, I feel like the Grinch. I am here managing a bill in which almost every account gets less money than it does for the current year. And the arguments for each of these programs, taken in isolation of course, is a persuasive argument, one that persuades me except for the fact that there is no free lunch. Every extra dollar for a program A must be taken out of program B. And most of the B's that have been sought so far have been functions which are only funded by the Federal Government, rather than grant functions, subsidies to the private sector, and the like. Nevertheless, I have every hope that we are going to be able to reach an accommodation on this. The junior Senator from Vermont, who was equally interested in the issue, is here. And so I have invited him and the Senator from Rhode Island to speak to these arts questions while we try to settle an amendment which will be proposed later and which perhaps under those circumstances can be accepted without further debate. If the Senator from Vermont will withhold for just a moment, I have a unanimous-consent request with respect to the committee report. I will ask that we take up and adopt the committee amendment that deals with the endowment so that an amendment to that will be in order when we get it settled. First, Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent to have printed in the Record a statement clarifying several provisions in the committee report accompanying this legislation.

Mr. GORTON

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, the Senator from Arkansas is most gracious and is the kind of Senator with whom it is a pleasure to work. He makes me want to agree with him. Mr. President, I suggest the absence of a quorum.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I would like to say the Senator from Idaho brings up an important point and one with a great deal of merit. If it was simply up to me, I would accept the amendment and go on. But I believe that we should recognize that it is clearly possible that this might be a contentious amendment and that there may be Members who disagree with the points made by the Senator from Idaho. So at this point, I would really like to put the Senate on notice that the amendment has been presented and ask that, if there are any objections to the amendment, they be communicated to either me or to the distinguished Senator from West Virginia. I hope that we can lay this amendment aside also and go on to something else until we find out whether or not anyone wants to debate against this amendment or to have a rollcall on it. Mr. PRYOR addressed the Chair.

Mr. GORTON

Mr. GORTON. That is perfectly satisfactory, Mr. President.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, we have now dealt with two of the most contentious amendments to this bill. We have now finished, I believe, debate on mining patents and on grazing, and the principal, but though not the only amendment on Indian programs. I have been prepared to go to a series of amendments on the endowments at this point. But the objection to the committee amendment on the endowments was lodged by Senator McCain, who is now chairing a markup in the Indian Affairs Committee. There is also an amendment on an African-American museum by Senator Simon, who has to attend that same committee session. I trust that it will be relatively short. We would be prepared to take another amendment on another subject. But, Mr. President, what I would like to announce is, of course, the majority leader and the managers of this bill would like to have a full debate but, at the same time, would like to finish the bill today. So I request that Members on my side try to get to me or to my staff within the course of the next hour and give us notice and, if they can, copies of the amendments they propose to lodge. I believe the distinguished Senator from West Virginia will make the same request. We would like to be in a position, within an hour or so, to get a unanimous-consent agreement at least as to the amendments that are available for consideration, so that we can see how to manage our time for the rest of the day.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote by which the amendment was rejected.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, there is a chart on the desk of each Member which is the only chart and set of figures which covers this bill as a whole. It indicates that land management agencies are reduced 14 percent, science agencies by 5 percent, cultural activities by 15 percent, the Department of Energy by 10 percent, Indian activities by 8 percent and other Department of the Interior functions by 14 percent, for a total of 11 percent. To concentrate on one aspect of one of those sections to the exclusion of all others is not to paint an appropriate picture for Members in dealing with a very difficult bill at a very difficult time. It is simply an error for the Senator from Minnesota or the Senator from Arizona to say that this preserves the bureaucracy in the Bureau of Indian Affairs. The largest account in the Bureau of Indian Affairs to be cut is central office operations, considerably larger than these self-government functions. The bottom line is that this amendment by its own terms will be devastating to primary responsibilities of the Government of the United States. They will probably be modified adversely to affect the National Park Service. It would have to be in order to become law, ultimately. And, Mr. President, this does not affect the poverty-oriented programs for Indian tribes. It simply affects the bureaucracy of the Bureau of Indian Affairs and of the governments of the various Indian tribes themselves. Overall, however, these reductions for Indian programs in this bill are less than those for land management agencies, for cultural activities, for the Department of Energy, for territorial administration, or for the main office of the Department of the Interior itself. This is a fair bill that will be distorted unfairly, unwisely, and unsustainably by this amendment.

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, I yield 4 minutes to the Senator from West Virginia.

Mr. GORTON. Indian programs even in the Department of the Interior are not cut 27 percent but 16 percent. But the point is from the perspective of the country as a whole, how much money is being reduced from Indian programs? In this bill, 8 percent; for everyone else, more than 12 percent. Indians are doing almost twice as well in this bill alone as are all of the other functions in this bill combined. Because of the budget resolution, there has to have been a reduction. These reductions are taken fairly.

Mr. GORTON. How much time remains?

Mr. GORTON. Mr. President, Members have on their desks a brief outline of what this bill does with respect to the agencies within the Department of the Interior and the other responsibilities of this subcommittee. The entire thrust of the argument for this bill has been aimed not at reductions in Indian programs, but at reductions of the appropriations for the Bureau of Indian Affairs, a Bureau, I may say, criticized by most of these same Members over the years as one of the least efficient and least responsive in the entire Federal Government. But the total reductions for the Bureau of Indian Affairs itself are 16 percent. The total reduction for Indian programs are 8 percent. By comparison, the Forest Service is reduced 22 percent, the various endowments by 39 percent, the Fish and Wildlife Service by 11 percent, territorial affairs by 23 percent. It is just simply not the case that Indian programs have been singled out for disproportionate reductions. I stand here, as does my colleague from West Virginia, to share with Members that frustration at the fact that, because of what we have decided to do in order to balance the budget, under the leadership of the Senator from New Mexico, we have, overall, 11 percent fewer dollars for our responsibilities. I want to emphasize once again, we have reduced Indian programs by only 8 percent, and they are not the programs the Senator from Arizona was talking about. These are not the programs that provide for education, or for health, or for housing, or for the relief of poverty. These are the moneys that go through the Bureau of Indian Affairs to give to Indian governments, which raise no money on their own--unlike every other form of local government in the United States. In order to see to it, at a time of starkly declining budgets for all of these agencies, that the Bureau of Indian Affairs, for all practical purposes, has no reduction, so that the total reduction for Indian programs is a mere 2 percent, this amendment would devastate responsibilities of the Government of the United States, which it literally cannot delegate to anyone else--the management of all of the lands owned and operated by the Bureau of Land Management. The Bureau of Land Management, quite accurately, tells us that it has already taken a $50 million reduction from the President's budget request and that its outreach programs, its recreational programs will, of necessity, have to go if this additional huge reduction is imposed upon it because it cannot abandon the land itself. The Fish and Wildlife Service, which is reduced $41 million from the President's proposal by our budget, and for which this amendment asks another $30 million reduction would, of necessity, come out of its recreation, its people-oriented activities. I read a list last night, that the Fish and Wildlife Service sent to us through the Department of the Interior, of more than 50 wildlife refuges that will close, as far as public access is concerned, because all that will be left is what is necessary for the preservation of habitat. They cover most of the States of the United States--as many as four or five in States like North Carolina and Oregon and Texas, and at least one in almost every other State. Of course, that is going to happen. This is a lot of money. There has been a colloquy submitted between the distinguished Democratic leader and the chairman of the Budget Committee with respect to the National Geological Survey and the EROS Data Center in Sioux Falls, SD. I can tell you, Mr. President, that Sioux Falls, SD, EROS Data Center is No. 1 on the list for the National Geological Survey for closure if this amendment is agreed to. It does not do much good to say it is not the intention of the sponsors to close it. It will close if this amendment becomes law. We have been in the process of distributing reductions which were forced on us--not ones which we asked for--in a field in which the Federal Government is solely responsible. We have been able to have no reductions at all only in the operations of the National Park Service and the cultural institutions here in Washington, DC, like the Smithsonian and National Gallery of Art, for which we are solely responsible, and the Indian Health Service, which is actually increased, the only significant item in this bill which is increased. Yet, these sponsors put on blinders. They do not tell you about the $1.8 billion worth of programs for Indians in other appropriations bills. They do not talk about Indian education or the Indian Health Service. They speak only about the BIA, and within that only one program within the BIA. If they wish to refocus the amounts of money to the BIA within this appropriation, I am certain that the Senator from West Virginia and I would be more than accommodating. But this does not attack the welfare and income maintenance programs of the Indians at all. And this bill, I must repeat, reduces Indian programs considerably less than it reduces the average of all other programs in this bill. It is extremely unfortunate, but it is the only fair way in accomplishing a goal.