Orrin Hatch

Mr. HATCH

Mr. HATCH. This amends the Elementary and Secondary Education Act of 1965, originally to provide $1 billion more but modified now to provide $340 million, after modification, a year in new funding to hire 141,000 school-based mental health personnel: 100,000 school counselors, 21,000 school psychologists, and 20,000 school social workers. These funds have to be matched by the States and localities. Now look, this is another attempt to micromanage our educational system in this country from Washington. It is an expensive add-on that should not be on this particular bill. I made the case earlier that we are in favor of counselors, but there is a limit to everything, and the counselors may or may not be the answer here, especially in the Klebold matter--in the Columbine matter, and a number of other matters where the boys were under counseling. The fact of the matter is, this is another ``Let's throw money at it'' at the cost of society.

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, I move to table the amendment and ask for the yeas and nays.

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. HATCH. Why don't we just have the rollcall vote and everybody will come immediately.

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, I understand that both sides are in agreement on the next amendment, so I ask unanimous consent that we vitiate the yeas and nays.

Mr. HATCH. I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent the Senator from New York be yielded 7 minutes for debate only, and the floor be immediately given back to me upon completion of his statement.

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, the next amendment happens to be the Ashcroft-Frist amendment. I suspect we should let both of them describe their amendment. Amendment No. 355

Mr. HATCH. I would have brought it to the floor before Littleton, but we didn't have the time to do it. But it certainly helped.

Mr. HATCH. And I am a strong supporter.

Mr. HATCH. Will the Senator yield without losing his right to the floor?

Mr. HATCH. I am suggesting we take some more time, but that we agree on a time limit so everybody in the Senate knows. What that does for you--you are concerned about Senators learning, knowing what to do and hearing your position--when they know there is a time certain, that is when Senators generally try to listen. I am not asking you not to take more time. I am not asking you to not filibuster. I am asking you--

Mr. HATCH. I am asking you to set a reasonable time limit. I am also suggesting, as somebody who has been around here as long as the Senator from Iowa, that the time-honored way to resolve these matters when you have a legitimate, honest difference of belief is to vote. Right now, the Senator does not have the right to a vote on his amendment, as I understand it.

Mr. HATCH. You cannot bring it up.

Mr. HATCH. I want your amendment to come up after this.

Mr. HATCH. You cannot get it up in this context without unanimous consent. I will get that for you.

Mr. HATCH. Sure you can. What I am saying is, let's vote, but do it after you have a reasonable time to explain your position. But let's set a time limit so 99 Senators are not held up.

Mr. HATCH. That is right.

Mr. HATCH. I am putting it in the order I think you want to be in.

Mr. HATCH. This adds $3 billion to programs we already covered in our prevention programs and does it in a way that has more Federal intrusion. I move to table the amendment.

Mr. HATCH. I yield back the remainder of my time, and we can yield to the Senator from Kentucky.

Mr. HATCH. How much does the other side have?

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, how much time do I have?

Mr. HATCH. Mr. President, this is not a civil rights vote. This is a vote that is an emotional vote. That is, they cannot show any reasons why people who commit heinous crimes should not go to jail. They are saying because there is a disproportionate number of African Americans--to select one group because that is the one they are talking about--going to jail for crimes they were convicted for, that somehow there is something wrong with that. Everybody in America knows that people are sentenced to jail because they have committed crimes. I admit that occasionally there are injustices in our courts, but they are very rare. When they do occur, I will decry them as much as my friend from Minnesota. This is what you call a bleeding heart amendment. They can't show the facts; they don't have any facts on their side. They are using statistics. They are ignoring the fact that people are convicted of these crimes and need to serve time for them, regardless of skin color; and they are ignoring the fact that we take care of this problem by providing a disproportionate amount of the prevention funds to help segments of the population having difficulties because of socioeconomic difficulties. That is the way to face it and solve the problem. Don't just complain about the problem. What is the solution? Is it that these people should not serve their time? Should they not be convicted when they sell drugs to our kids? Everybody knows that it happens. It is nice to talk about civil rights. The fact of the matter is that nobody is more concerned about civil rights than I am. If anyone can show me where there is prejudice, if they can show me where these people are not justly convicted, that is another matter. I will be right there marching with them. But they can't and they know it. Mr. President, I am going to yield 2 minutes to the distinguished Senator from Alabama, and then I will yield back the remainder of our time.