William Roth

Mr. ROTH

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. ROTH. I move to lay that motion on the table. The motion to lay on the table was agreed to.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that reading of the amendments be dispensed with.

Mr. ROTH. I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. ROTH

Mr. ROTH. I move to lay that motion on the table. The motion to lay on the table was agreed to. Mr. BYRD addressed the Chair.

Mr. ROTH. I thank my esteemed colleague for his courtesy as it is very helpful in moving this legislation forward. I first yield to Senator Kerrey to offer one amendment. Amendment No. 2361 (Purpose: To express the policy of Congress that the Internal Revenue Service should work cooperatively with the private sector to increase electronic filing)

Mr. ROTH. I yield back our time.

Mr. ROTH. As Senator Kerrey indicated, this amendment is acceptable to us, and I urge its adoption.

Mr. ROTH. That is part of the proposal.

Mr. ROTH. I now yield to Senator Grassley.

Mr. ROTH. I move to lay that motion on the table. The motion to lay on the table was agreed to.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I say that both of these amendments are acceptable to the majority side. We have worked with Senator Kerrey on them and we think they are acceptable. So I urge that they be accepted by voice vote.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I want to echo what was just said by Senator Kerrey. We do intend to complete this legislation today. So it is critically important that those who have amendments, if they want to have them offered, that they do so promptly because time is slipping by. We will stay here until we complete the legislation. It is my understanding that Senator Faircloth wants to go next. We would like to get a time agreement. I mentioned that to Senator Kerrey, as well as to Senator Faircloth. I would like to have 30 minutes divided equally between the two sides.

Mr. ROTH. Twenty minutes.

Mr. ROTH. Shall we make it 20 minutes?

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I ask unanimous consent that for the Faircloth amendment there be a time limit of 20 minutes equally divided between the two sides and no second-degree amendments.

Mr. ROTH

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I send an amendment to the desk.

Mr. ROTH

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I say to the distinguished Senator that I do want to ask for an agreement on the 40 minutes, but I have to wait for Senator Kerrey to return. I will raise that when he comes.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I move to reconsider the vote.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, as I indicated before the distinguished Senator from Missouri spoke, we had a tentative agreement of 40 minutes for this amendment, with 20 minutes to a side. I ask that we unanimously agree to that with the time that the distinguished Senator used to discuss the amendment being deducted from the 20 minutes. I understand that is roughly 13 minutes. Is that satisfactory?

Mr. ROTH. Is the Senator ready to yield the balance of his time?

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, as I mentioned earlier, Alan Greenspan says that America's most important economic problem is its low savings rate. With that, I agree. As a practical matter, I have done my very best the last several years to try to build the kind of incentives into the tax picture that would promote savings on the part of the American people. The rollover provision in this amendment is a small step toward resolving our No. 1 economic problem. Just let me point out what we are saying. What we are proposing is letting older people keep the money that they have saved. We are not asking them to do anything that others are not able to do. As a practical matter, the way the system now works, it discriminates against the older people. The problem is that if you are under the age of 70\1/2\, there is no requirement that you make withdrawals from your IRA. It is only when you reach 70\1/2\ that you are required to do so under the deductible IRA. So there is a built-in discrimination against the senior citizens. I think that is wrong. Again, let me emphasize what we are talking about. What we are proposing is to treat these older Americans, those that are over 70\1/ 2\, to have the same kind of treatment as those that are younger than 70\1/2\. As I said, if you are under 70\1/2\ there is no requirement of withdrawals, and of course the basic problem is that if you have income in excess of $100,000 you are not entitled to this benefit. Let me correct one further point that has been made. My distinguished friend and colleague, Senator Kerrey, has said that the purpose of the IRA rollover provision is to allow heirs to escape payment of estate taxes. That is just not the case. If the IRA is part of the estate, then the individual who passes on is subject to the estate tax. If he or she tries to give it during the lifetime to someone else, and it is a permanent irrevocable gift, then it is subject to the gift tax. So there is no escaping of estate taxes by this provision. Let me just say, as we all know, the Roth IRA has become a very popular savings vehicle. A taxpayer, as I said, who has a regular IRA may convert their regular IRA into a Roth IRA as long as the taxpayer and the taxpayer's spouse have adjusted income of $100,000 or less. Again, let me repeat, older Americans are now required to receive minimum distribution from their regular IRA on an annual basis beginning in the year following the year they attain the age of 70\1/ 2\. Those required distributions must be counted, under current law, as part of the older taxpayer-adjusted gross income, which in some instances will cause these older Americans to become ineligible to roll over their IRAs. My amendment gives these older taxpayers the opportunity to roll over their IRAs into Roth IRAs by not counting these required minimum distributions toward $100,000 adjusted growth income. It is only fair, in my judgment, that these older taxpayers are given the same ability to roll over their IRAs and not be penalized because they must take distribution from their regular IRA solely because of their age. Let's be clear here, the revenue cost by this provision comes from taxpayers who will pay tax on their regular IRA when they convert to the Roth IRA. These conversions are entirely voluntary on the part of the taxpayers. Mr. President, I ask the Members of this distinguished body to support the Roth amendment because I think it brings equity into the picture and only treats the senior citizens the same as the younger. Mr. KERREY addressed the Chair.

Mr. ROTH. That would be fine.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. President, I yield the balance of my time.