Gene Taylor

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. I am asking a question, sir. It is a parliamentary inquiry. Did we pass the bill?

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, I demand a recorded vote.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, I thank the gentleman for yielding. He is very gentlemanly to do that. Mr. Chairman, I am going to use my time to say that this is a bad amendment, referring to the Hoyer amendment, to an already terrible bill. It is going to waste $16 billion American dollars, money we have to borrow in order to give away to rich countries like Israel and Egypt. But worse than that, the Hoyer amendment would call for the wasting of American lives. Testimony before the Committee on Armed Services coming from the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Colin Powell, says you cannot just give people surface-to-air missiles. You cannot just give people heavy artillery. You have to send people over there first to deliver it and then to train them to use it, and that means putting American service personnel on the ground in the Bosnia, which is going to lead to the loss of American lives in a 700-year-old war. Those who think that the Moslems from the Middle East are going to stand by once we lift the embargo or the Russians are going to stand by once we lift the embargo and not help the Croatians are absolutely crazy. Where is the rush to squander American lives? Yesterday this Congress did the right thing in voting not to get rid of the War Powers Act and voting not to give President Clinton more power to send American kids off to get killed. If you are so anxious to go help the Moslems or the Croatians or the Serbs, put down your briefcase, pick up a gun, and go have a lot of fun. But do not send American troops off to do what you will not do. Do you squander their lives for a hopeless war in a part of the world where we do not belong.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, let me begin by saying that I am very much in agreement with the fact that we have to balance the budget and balance it soon. I really resent, however, speaker after speaker coming to the podium telling people what a terrible Nation we have. This Nation saved the world from Hitler. This Nations saved the world from the imperial Japanese. This Nation saved the world from communism. This Nation saved the world, and all of it has a cost. The gentleman from New Jersey [Mr. Saxton], in his statements, said we would be much better off if we privatize everything. I am not in total disagreement that we ought to privatize some things. However, is it not realistic that the biggest expense to this Nation is the combined Medicare-Medicaid? The next biggest expense is national defense. The third largest expense is interest on the national debt. I would ask the gentleman from New Jersey, which of those things would he privatize, because we have just gobbled up almost 70 percent of the budget.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. I yield to the gentleman from Pennsylvania.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, for many decades the Corps of Engineers, being like all of us, were creatures of habit in that when they dredged, they would take the spoils and throw it to the nearest possible place without much regard for the effects on the environment, whether they were destroying an oyster reef, whether they were filling in a marsh, whether they were destroying a swamp. To their credit, the corps has now gone in another direction, and perhaps to an extreme. Just recently in south Mississippi a 7-mile pipeline was constructed to remove the dredged material from Biloxi Bay and pump it farther inland. In another instance, what is known to be toxic dredged materials in the harbor at Pass Christian is being hauled inland, but in not every instance, as the gentleman from New Jersey [Mr. Pallone] has pointed out, is the dredge material polluted. In many instances it is virgin bottom, it is not polluted, and it can be used for other things. I think the Corps of Engineers would be very wise to consider a third alternative other than ocean dumping, other than hauling the material inland. That would be to create coastal marshes or wetlands with the dredged material. This would do three very valuable things. No. 1, it would create wetlands. As we all know, we have lost about half the wetlands in this country in the past 100 years. No. 2, it would save money, because in most instances it would be the cheapest way to dispose of the dredged material, the closest to the channels that are being dredged. No. 3, in States like Louisiana and my home State of Mississippi, we are losing some very valuable property to coastal erosion. There is a national historic landmark, the lighthouse at Rhode Island, MS, that is soon to wash into the sea if something is not done to prevent the erosion of that island. Last, Mr. Chairman, it would create wildlife habitat. Therefore, I have spoken to both the majority and minority on this matter. We are asking, but not directing, the Corps of Engineers that whenever practicable, to take this dredged material and consider the use of it for creating wetlands and marshes with this dredged material, rather than, A, hauling it inland, or B, dragging it out to the middle of the ocean.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, I offer an amendment.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. I do not think the Chair responded----

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, the rules of the House with regard to questions of privilege very clearly state that whenever something that questions the integrity of the proceedings of this body is called into question, then it is the privilege of any Member of this body to try to resolve that issue. And, of course, the entire reason for the motion was to expedite a ruling on something that could well result in a mammoth tax decrease for one individual, something that many Members of this body think brings the integrity of this body into question. When we are granting tax relief to someone who apparently has had very lucrative book deals with the heads of state of many countries, who offered a lucrative book deal--though rejected--to the Speaker of the House and then just within 91 days of that offer gets an enormous tax break, I think is prima facie evidence that would bring the integrity of the proceedings of this House into question. Therefore, I speak on behalf and in defense of the gentleman's motion that this be a privileged resolution.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, since the rules of the House clearly state that when the question of the integrity of the proceedings of this House have been violated, that is indeed a privileged resolution. Now, I realize that the Chair responded to the written request of my colleague, but I have also asked the Chair to respond to whether or not it is prima facie evidence that a question relating to the integrity of the proceedings of this body are called into question when one individual who earlier this session offered the Speaker of the House an over $4 million book deal which the Speaker turned down, but he still offered it and with--that is a parliamentary inquiry. I have just as much right as the Members.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, I have a parliamentary inquiry.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. I do, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, I do not feel like the Chair has responded to my question of whether or not they felt like----

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. A question of the integrity of the proceedings of this House has been brought into play.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, a parliamentary inquiry.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, I have a parliamentary inquiry.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, I want to begin by complimenting everyone on the civility that has been shown thus far. I remind my Republican colleagues that our Nation is over $4 trillion in debt. This Nation this year will borrow over $200 billion just to make ends meet. That money has to be repaid. In the 2 minutes that I address this body, the American people will spend $1 million just on interest on the national debt. For those of you who have a Visa card or any other charge card, you know what interest is. It is money that is wasted. Sometimes it is a bargain to spend money ahead of time and pay it back later but it is never a bargain for your Nation to borrow money. Last year on June 6 I happened to stand on the bluffs of Normandy amongst 10,000 crosses, a cross for every person that lives in my hometown almost. Those people, like my colleague Sam Gibbons, many of them jumped out of airplanes in the dark the night before. Many of them died. They jumped for $90 a month. No one ever asked those people would they do it for a tax break. Do you love your country only if you get a tax break, if you get more back than you gave to it? They did it because they loved their country. This Nation has done wonderful things and it troubles me when I see my Republican friends belittle the wonderful things this country has done. This country saved the world from Adolf Hitler. This country saved the world from communism. But there is a bill that had to be paid with that. The defense bill of the 1980's that I think was wonderful has to be paid. It was over $300 billion a year. It makes no sense at all to turn around and say that we just saved a couple of billion dollars last week, so let's give it away. Because you are not giving it away, you are borrowing more money. If you want to threaten the very thing that Sam Johnson sat in a POW camp for for 5 years in Vietnam, or the very thing that Sam Gibbons jumped out of an airplane in the middle of the night for, if you want to threaten the democracy of this great Nation, the world's greatest Nation, don't pay your bills. Let this Nation collapse like Mexico. Let this Nation collapse like Yugoslavia. If you love your country, be willing to pay for it.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, in response to my good friend, the gentleman from Ohio [Mr. Hoke], who quoted John Kennedy, I would like to remind him, I reminded him privately, I will remind him publicly, at the time John Kennedy said that, the Nation's annual operating deficit was $10 billion a year, Now it is $200 billion a year. At the time that John Kennedy said that, our Nation's total debt was about $500 billion. Today it is almost $5 trillion. Now, we have a very strange situation with the tax cutters who, as my good friend, the gentleman from New York [Mr. Solomon], pointed out, should be for deficit reduction. I am one of those people, Mr. Solomon. I am for deficit reduction. So I am going to say that whatever we save go toward the deficit, because it does not make any sense at all for this Nation to borrow $200 billion this year and pay the interest on it for the next 10 years just to give people a very miniscule break today and to give the wealthiest Americans, whose maximum tax rate went from 66 percent in 1981 down to about 35 percent today, an even bigger tax break.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Speaker, by the clock on the wall, it is 20 minutes after 12. By 30 minutes after 12 this Nation will have spent another $5 million on interest on the national debt. Because of the national debt, we are spending $1 million every 2 minutes just to pay the interest. That is not the principal; that is just the interest. That is why I want to compliment my Republican colleagues on passing some much-needed cuts. They were not the cuts I would have made, but they were necessary because we have to reduce spending. Let me criticize them for not taking those savings and applying it toward our annual operating deficits but instead to give a tax break to millionaires. This Nation will still spend about $200 billion more than it collects in taxes this year. That means the debt goes up and that means the interest on that, for those of you who are wondering where your tax money goes, the biggest portion of the money that you pay in taxes goes to pay interest on the national debt, does not pave an inch of highway, does not buy one round for one M-16, does not educate a child. It goes to some rich lending institution and the chances are one out of three that that money goes to a German or a Japanese lending institution because they are the ones who control our debt.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, I thank the gentleman for recognizing me. Mr. Chairman, I think term limits is a foolish idea, and I think this is a particularly foolish idea. I was privileged to be elected to this body in October of 1989. My very first meeting in the House Committee on Armed Services also happened to be Colin Powell's very first meeting before that committee as Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. He had over 30 years to learn his job, yet he makes recommendations that only the House Committee on Armed Services and then this body and the U.S. Senate can vote on, because the Constitution gives us the authority to declare war. The Constitution says we shall provide for an Army and for a Navy. I would think the proponents of this measure could not stand before this body right now and tell us what a D-5 is or Mark 48, or why we need a Seawolf submarine or the Centurion submarine. The bottom line is the House Committee on Armed Services makes 275 billion dollars' worth of decisions every year. These are decisions that affect your lives. This body can vote to annihilate the world. These decisions should not be made lightly, and they should not be made by people who do not know what they are talking about. And if it took Colin Powell, who is a brilliant man, 30 years to learn his job, then I would say that people in this body need at least 12 to learn theirs.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, I was hoping that at some point this body would be made aware, at which point in his 17 years as a Congressman did the Speaker decide that he was for a 12-year term limit.

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, will the gentleman yield?

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi

Mr. TAYLOR of Mississippi. Mr. Chairman, let me begin by saying how appropriate it is that a former prisoner of war for 7 years in Hanoi Hilton is the sponsor of this amendment. Unlike many Members of this body who claim to be promilitary but sought student deferments, the gentleman from Florida [Mr. Peterson] is promilitary and enlisted in our country's Armed Forces. I say this because he also, on the first day of this body, voted to put Congress under the same laws as every other member of the American society, as did I, and as did the majority in this body. We did not say we are special; we said we should live by the same laws as everyone else. Yet, some people in this room this very day will say they are better than a prospective Congressman because they should be allowed to serve their 20 years, their 18 years, their 50 years, and then and only then should the 12-year limit go on top of that. That is wrong. That is egomaniacal of the worst sort. That is the sort of thing that really makes America mad at Congress. I want to commend my good friends, the gentleman from Florida [Mr. Peterson], the gentleman from Michigan [Mr. Dingell], both former service people serving our country, both of whom realized that Congress ought to live by the same laws as everyone else. I will say one last thing, Mr. Chairman, I am a cosponsor of an amendment to prohibit the burning of the flag. Until it becomes law, I am not going to burn any flags. For those of the Members who feel so strongly about term limits and who have served more than 12 years, I encourage them not to run for reelection.